Zen Master Seung Sahn used to tell us, "A Zen master is like a bad man leading you with a candle in the dark. Sometimes this man does 'good' actions and speech, sometimes 'bad' actions or speech. If you only attach to this man's actions -- his speech, what kind of expressions, what he or she eats or has or does -- then you cannot see this light clearly, and maybe you fall into a ditch! Only this light -- this Dharma-light. This is what might help your life, more than 'This man is good' or 'This man's actions very bad!' Don't attach too much to this man's actions -- you must use this light, then get to a good place. This is also for our own minds. If we always check 'good' and 'bad' in our minds, we never see our original light. Then we cannot do anything. Cannot help anybody."
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Here is the full conversation with Paul Bloom. https://uncertain.substack.com/p/paul-bloom-empathy-morality-suffering?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&utm_source=copy